Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

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Petebass
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by Petebass » 06 Dec 2017, 13:41

Aussie Mark wrote:
06 Dec 2017, 12:29
Things go a bit quiet in this thread when Labor pollies turn out to be dual citizens as well. And to add to the circus at the moment, Barnaby is back.
I had an overnighter in Bundaberg last night, so on the drive home I got to hear both Bourke (Labor)and Brandis (Liberal) talk about this on morning radio. The Labor line for the 3 that aren't Feeney is "The high court will rule in their favour because they look at whether or not all reasonable steps were taken prior to taking office. In all 3 cases the appropriate paperwork was lodged before the election, with the result coming back after the election. But all possible steps were taken, nothing more could have been done!"

I hate to say it but this raised a question in my head, and Brandis answered it with his reply: "Rubbish! All 3 were pre-selected many months before the election. They all chose to wait until the writs for the election were issued to lodge their citizenship paperwork. Why did they wait so long?"

He has a point!

It turns out the infallible Labor process upon which Shorten has been confident to guarantee Labor has no problems, well ..... it involves 12 pages of questions relating to Section 44, but does not require copies of the actual documents to be presented. So Feeny can't find his paperwork, not surprising given it's been 10+ years. But make them show the documents up front and all future problems are eliminated aren't they?
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by veebass » 06 Dec 2017, 14:51

^ @Petebass
Not so sure about Brandis' claim about the preselection of those candidates many months earlier.
The last Federal election was held on 2 July 2016.
Turnbull called the election on 8 May, 2016.
I don't know the details for the three Brandis is referring to but our Branch's candidate was finally approved by State Office in early May 2016 just before the election was called. That was after several interviews and lots of background checking. I know the local LNP candidate was not endorsed until after the election was called. So you would have to wonder how much time he had to do this stuff.
It may be the case that the order of Senate candidates are decided earlier by the Parties, but I recall the ALP Senate order in Qld was still the subject of contention around April last year.

The three ALP guys who will use Sykes and Cleary will say the delay was with the other country's processes, so beyond their control. We will see what the High Court says, along with the four Greeks in the Coalition.

Bit rich to pick holes in the Labor process. At least Labor had a process.
If Feeney has been lying it may well cost him his seat. The Greens may well knock him off in a by election.
Interesting to see if Labor nominates him.
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by Aussie Mark » 06 Dec 2017, 15:06

In short, they're all as hopeless as each other. Nothing's changed.

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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by veebass » 06 Dec 2017, 15:30

Aussie Mark wrote:
06 Dec 2017, 15:06
In short, they're all as hopeless as each other. Nothing's changed.
Not at all. I think the approaches are quite different.
Largely the Coalition have ignored it and "so the High Court has held".
Largely Labor have attempted to comply. We will see what the High Court says about them.

It will be interesting to see how the High Court rules on the Coalition "Greeks".
Labor's position has been they needed to do something at each election because of some peculiarity with Greek law, which I don't pretend to understand, and the Coalition, you guessed it, have ignored it.
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by veebass » 06 Dec 2017, 16:41

Obviously targeting Get Up.

If they are going to try and extend this stuff so wide that it will pick up charities, as seems to be the case from stuff I have read elsewhere, as a by product of the drive to get Get Up, it all begs some obvious questions.
If we are so concerned about foreign influence;
Will foreign owned and subsidised media continue be allowed to editorialise on politics in Australia? Much of what is attempted to be passed off as political reporting in Australia is editorialising.
Will massive foreign owned companies be allowed to engage in political campaigns of the like the mining industry launched on the Rudd Government in future?.
Will we persist with TPP 2.0 or 3.0 (where ever we are up to), when it will allow foreign entities to interfer with law making here in a very direct fashion?

Much more concerning is an Opposition Senator taking some money for his personal use (still can't believe that is actually not illegal at present).

Couldn't the whole thing be covered off by making what Dastyari did illegal, as most people would expect it to be?

Seems to be a very large over reach going on here.

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/ ... zzck2.html
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by Petebass » 06 Dec 2017, 17:02

Bob Carr was on radio this morning trying to explain the problems with the foreign donations thingy. Man, he was completely useless. What I "think" he was trying to say in his uncomprehendable waffling was that Brandis has completely underestimated how far-reaching these reforms will be. He rattled off this long list of entities, repeatedly, most of which I'd never heard of that would be caught in the net. We were probably supposed to assume all the enties he mentioned were doing "good", but how would we know?

To me it looks like the govt has been forced into swerving to avoid the elephant on the road, and has opened the car door while they're there to take a swipe at Get-up because they can, but haven't thought it through.
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by veebass » 06 Dec 2017, 17:31

Petebass wrote:
06 Dec 2017, 17:02
Bob Carr was on radio this morning trying to explain the problems with the foreign donations thingy. Man, he was completely useless. What I "think" he was trying to say in his uncomprehendable waffling was that Brandis has completely underestimated how far-reaching these reforms will be. He rattled off this long list of entities, repeatedly, most of which I'd never heard of that would be caught in the net. We were probably supposed to assume all the enties he mentioned were doing "good", but how would we know?

To me it looks like the govt has been forced into swerving to avoid the elephant on the road, and has opened the car door while they're there to take a swipe at Get-up because they can, but haven't thought it through.
Yep, I think so.

Bob Carr has an interest in this issue, as does Andrew Robb.
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by Aussie Mark » 07 Dec 2017, 08:53

veebass wrote:
06 Dec 2017, 15:30
Aussie Mark wrote:
06 Dec 2017, 15:06
In short, they're all as hopeless as each other. Nothing's changed.
Not at all. I think the approaches are quite different.
By "all" I meant the pollies from a variety of parties who have been clueless about the dual citizenship snafu. We've now had Libs, ALP, Nats, Greens, ON and independents caught out via a combination of ignorance, failure to check, documentation errors, lies, or staff member balls ups. These people take the responsibility of representing the people far too casually. Sack 'em all!

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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by veebass » 07 Dec 2017, 09:23

Aussie Mark wrote:
07 Dec 2017, 08:53
veebass wrote:
06 Dec 2017, 15:30
Aussie Mark wrote:
06 Dec 2017, 15:06
In short, they're all as hopeless as each other. Nothing's changed.
Not at all. I think the approaches are quite different.
By "all" I meant the pollies from a variety of parties who have been clueless about the dual citizenship snafu. We've now had Libs, ALP, Nats, Greens, ON and independents caught out via a combination of ignorance, failure to check, documentation errors, lies, or staff member balls ups. These people take the responsibility of representing the people far too casually. Sack 'em all!
I think the issue has been taken too lightly by some.
I probably need to wait for a court finding to add the Labor guys into this characterisation.

I might have been hasty having a shot at Feeney. Labor has referred him because he can't prove what he is saying he did ten years ago. (as is the case with a number of Coalition people BTW) I heard Tony Burke talking about it with Leigh Sales last night. He said Feeney had issues with both Irish and British citizenships. Feeney reckons he took action on both at the same time but can only find proof of the Irish stuff. The Brits can't find a record of his British renunciation, but they only started looking recently when Feeney tried to find his paperwork and failed to do so, after it became apparent a week or two back that he was going to need it. .Burke's comment was that it makes no sense to act on one and not the other if he was aware of them both, as he says. Let's see what happens there. The rest of them are Sykes and Cleary cases.
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by Aussie Mark » 07 Dec 2017, 10:39

veebass wrote:
07 Dec 2017, 09:23
Aussie Mark wrote:
07 Dec 2017, 08:53
veebass wrote:
06 Dec 2017, 15:30


Not at all. I think the approaches are quite different.
By "all" I meant the pollies from a variety of parties who have been clueless about the dual citizenship snafu. We've now had Libs, ALP, Nats, Greens, ON and independents caught out via a combination of ignorance, failure to check, documentation errors, lies, or staff member balls ups. These people take the responsibility of representing the people far too casually. Sack 'em all!
I think the issue has been taken too lightly by some.
I probably need to wait for a court finding to add the Labor guys into this characterisation.

I might have been hasty having a shot at Feeney. Labor has referred him because he can't prove what he is saying he did ten years ago. (as is the case with a number of Coalition people BTW) I heard Tony Burke talking about it with Leigh Sales last night. He said Feeney had issues with both Irish and British citizenships. Feeney reckons he took action on both at the same time but can only find proof of the Irish stuff. The Brits can't find a record of his British renunciation, but they only started looking recently when Feeney tried to find his paperwork and failed to do so, after it became apparent a week or two back that he was going to need it. .Burke's comment was that it makes no sense to act on one and not the other if he was aware of them both, as he says. Let's see what happens there. The rest of them are Sykes and Cleary cases.
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by veebass » 07 Dec 2017, 11:33

The Dastyari stuff is getting a real sinister feel to it.
The News story below is inferring motives that may not have been there but more importantly seeking to close off opposition questioning of the government. It is clearly supporting the line of government attack.
The other issue for me is the government needs to be a little more careful about offending China. It could end up being very costly.

If they have real security concerns about Dastyari they should provide what intelligence they have to Shorten and give him the chance to take appropriate action rather than conduct it as a political game in the media. It seems all they have is the word of an associate of Mr Huang who is now working for the Liberal Party. This has a real ugly feel to it for me, like much of Federal politics at the moment.

http://www.skynews.com.au/news/top-stor ... ns-_071217
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by PilbaraBass » 07 Dec 2017, 12:47

On the subject of "foreigners"... food for thought.

Does anyone feel it's right for someone who lives in one electorate to be able to be elected and represent a different electorate?

I realise that it's not the same as being a dual citizen... But there still, IMO, exists a similar "conflict of interest" or can demonstrate a "lack of commitment" to a representative's electorate. In other words, personal political career over constituency.
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by vin-tone » 07 Dec 2017, 13:38

^^IMO That's for the electorate to decide. John Alexander byelection is a good example. See how it goes.
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by maxgroover » 07 Dec 2017, 14:03

I would rather have a person who doesn't live in my electorate but does an awesome job for my electorate, than a person who lives in my electorate who does an average job.
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Re: Political Coverage By the Media in Our Country - PART TWO

Post by Petebass » 07 Dec 2017, 14:16

Has anyone else noticed how many journalists and broadcasters have trouble pronouncing "citizenship". Even someone as politically savvy as Patricia Karvelas on ABC seems to say "cissssenship".

And don't get me started on Ita Buttrose :)
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