Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

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slowlearner
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by slowlearner » 30 Nov 2017, 18:18

Got the rods in with a bit more router table "magic"... yeah, lets call it that and don't look too closely.

Image

BTW, why can't you just glue the rods in the titebond?
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by drbass » 30 Nov 2017, 19:27

"Magic" - a little bit is all it takes.

Titebond requires pressure and absorbing surfaces (like timber - and it doesn't work so great with oily wood) whereas araldite/epoxy does not require pressure and bonds pretty much anything.

Here's a couple of pics for what it's worth now:


This shows that there is just a little bit of clearance in the rout - the rods drop in with just the slightest hint of resistance.


This is with one glued in. As you can see the rout was a little bit deeper than the rod's height so it's now completely covered by araldite.

Regards,
Michael
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by slowlearner » 01 Dec 2017, 06:11

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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by slowlearner » 09 Dec 2017, 21:53

I won't pretend I haven't been avoiding this job, procrastinating and over-thinking it... ie. panicking about which way I will fail and ruin the neck blank...

However, today I pulled out my finger and presto!

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Because the epoxy was so thick (I got the slow cure stuff) and the rods were tight-ish, I had to knock them in a little and wipe off the excess.

Image

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Done! After a little sanding, it'll be ready for the board to go on tomorrow. Yay, radius sanding next... Hmm.
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by drbass » 10 Dec 2017, 05:23

There you go, Pete, that wasn’t so bad, right? ;)

Looks good to me. Stating the obvious: looks like there might be some epoxy on the neck - you will have to use epoxy to glue the finger/fretboard if that’s the case.

Regards,
Michael
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by SneakyJak » 10 Dec 2017, 06:44

Out of interest and I don’t know why Jens the luthier I’ve been building my acoustic in his workshop only uses epoxy for glueing fretboards.

I’ll ask and find out why he prefers that over yellow glue if you’re interested

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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by slowlearner » 10 Dec 2017, 07:14

drbass wrote:
10 Dec 2017, 05:23
There you go, Pete, that wasn’t so bad, right? ;)

Looks good to me. Stating the obvious: looks like there might be some epoxy on the neck - you will have to use epoxy to glue the finger/fretboard if that’s the case.

Regards,
Michael
Honestly, it wasn't a barrel of fun. I do prefer titebond. Easier to clean up and much cheaper.

If you're serious about needing to glue the board on with epoxy, that's an extra step of frustration.
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by drbass » 10 Dec 2017, 11:39

SneakyJak wrote:
10 Dec 2017, 06:44
Out of interest and I don’t know why Jens the luthier I’ve been building my acoustic in his workshop only uses epoxy for glueing fretboards.

I’ll ask and find out why he prefers that over yellow glue if you’re interested
The "yellow glue" introduces moisture since it's water-based which may give issues - I think that's why. Epoxy also fills any gaps you have. My preference would be to work with epoxy for everything but it's obviously much more expensive.

Warwick use Collano Semparoc 12 NV (a polyurethane glue) for EVERYTHING - might be worth looking into that. It's a single tube proposition, can fill gaps and is even used in boating.

Regards,
Michael
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by slowlearner » 10 Dec 2017, 23:20

Pinned the edges of the board in place before I mixed up any Araldite...

Image

In retrospect, maybe it's not quite as bad as I think it is. I definitely put too much on to begin with, but I used the super strength. That gives me 30min play time before it starts to set. Which is pretty great. I scraped a bunch off before I stuck the board on and started clamping it up.

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With all the clamps on, I had enough squeeze out. I even managed to avoid sticking it to the work bench... I know, right. Genius.

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All glued. Takes 72 hours (3 days) to go rock solid, but then it's good for 150kg. Um yeah, overkill. BTW, how nice is the flame in that Jarrah.
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by Curto » 12 Dec 2017, 07:00

drbass wrote:
10 Dec 2017, 11:39
My preference would be to work with epoxy for everything but it's obviously much more expensive.

Warwick use Collano Semparoc 12 NV (a polyurethane glue) for EVERYTHING - might be worth looking into that. It's a single tube proposition, can fill gaps and is even used in boating.

Regards,
Michael


Interesting! I'll be glueing up some boards over the holidays and was going to buy some Titebond. I'm reconsidering now ... :hmm Do you use any epoxy installing the truss rod?
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by slowlearner » 15 Dec 2017, 10:46

You don't use any epoxy in the rod channel, but I did wrap it up in insulating tape first to get it nice and tight.

I did use titebond gluing the extra block on the end of the neck. Here's last night's efforts. Was crazy hot here (42degC) so I didn't do anything until quite late.

Image
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by slowlearner » 19 Dec 2017, 15:23

Well, my brother gave me a call today. He's a music teacher and needed to get rid of this old gem...

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It's an old Eko.


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Obviously, in a public highschool it's lived a hard life. Just from a proper pic of the top you can see it's pretty dead and nasty. I don't know if it's plywood (my guess), but it's obviously died from the cracks.

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Still that's ok. The neck is bolt on and it's a multi-laminate too. Pretty awesome stuff and right up my alley.

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The first guitar I built was dubbed 'Skeletor' by a friend at Jazz club. What I'm hoping is the frets are pretty good on the EKO and I can build Skeletor II. I'll have to hunt around in my PU collection. I may also need another set of tuners. When I offered to build my bro one he started complaining about being poked in the belly with a PU screw on my current Skeletor. Honesty, some people are never happy. :lol:

This one might even get some paint and a little sanding. Don't tell anyone, I'll loose my reputation for building horrible junk.

P.s. what shape should I make the Skeletor II?
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by slowlearner » 21 Dec 2017, 22:30

Back in the shed today amongst looking at an octopus, stringrays and sharks. I started on radiusing the fingerboard a few days back. Got it done today. I keep thinking, "I should build a router sled". Then I never do it. So it started with a plane and finished the hard way.

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Still it's all done now so I can move on to carving. I've marked out where the headstock will screw on.

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Just curious to know...

How thick do you have your neck? The blank is 24mm from fingerboard to the back of the neck. How much do you shave them back?
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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by aphekgreg » 22 Dec 2017, 09:08

slowlearner wrote:
10 Nov 2017, 06:19

Have another question about PUs. If you used super strong magnets to hold your PUs on, would that effect the magnetic field of PU negatively?
I missed this question. Additional magnets will change the gauss reading of the pickup. The biggest issue, would be making sure the increase was spread evenly across the pickup.

I just did a test for you, where I added a strong neo disk magnet to a J style pickup. This was an experimental pickup with high guass in the first place, around 1050. The neo by itself has a gauss reading around 1900. Sticking it to the back of the J pickup, it went up to around 1300.
Greg

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Re: Build #12 - 6 string fretless (warning; crazy content)

Post by slowlearner » 22 Dec 2017, 13:05

Ok, interesting. Stew from Nordstrand advised against it. What you've just shown me is the opportunity/disadvantage to have what's in effect a much hotter PU. Right?
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