Future Builds - Kinda Not Random

Building, Modding, Setup and Repair
User avatar
Classic5
Posts: 3785
Joined: 15 Oct 2009, 19:33
Location: Melbourne

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by Classic5 » 23 Feb 2018, 20:54

Interesting comment about the epoxy for larger areas :hmm
IB-Classic#001, Xotic XJ-1T 5,Yamaha BB1024X
Glockenklang Blue Soul, Glockenklang Double, TecAmp Puma 112 Combo
"Money will buy a fine dog but only kindness will make him wag his tail"

User avatar
drbass
Posts: 3068
Joined: 04 Apr 2013, 05:31
Location: Doreen, Victoria
Contact:

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by drbass » 24 Feb 2018, 14:35

Ivan dropped in for a coffee and a chat earlier today. He didn’t mind what he saw (encouraging) but you’ll all have to wait until the whole bass is finished - sorry.

Regards,
Michael
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
- Genzler Magellan 800, 2 Genzler BA12-3

User avatar
Classic5
Posts: 3785
Joined: 15 Oct 2009, 19:33
Location: Melbourne

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by Classic5 » 24 Feb 2018, 17:07

drbass wrote:
24 Feb 2018, 14:35
Ivan dropped in for a coffee and a chat earlier today. He didn’t mind what he saw (encouraging) but you’ll all have to wait until the whole bass is finished - sorry.

Regards,
Michael
It was great to catch up Michael, and meet your lovely family. The latest bass looks exceptional.......it's a seriously good build and a real stunner. I won't give any more away than that....... :thumbup:

Needless to say, I'm awaiting it's completion with eager anticipation, and to say that I didn't mind what I saw is a massive understatement.
IB-Classic#001, Xotic XJ-1T 5,Yamaha BB1024X
Glockenklang Blue Soul, Glockenklang Double, TecAmp Puma 112 Combo
"Money will buy a fine dog but only kindness will make him wag his tail"

packrat
Posts: 631
Joined: 27 Oct 2017, 02:17
Location: Sydney

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by packrat » 24 Feb 2018, 18:19

All this mystery is just going to see more people asking you to take pictures.

User avatar
drbass
Posts: 3068
Joined: 04 Apr 2013, 05:31
Location: Doreen, Victoria
Contact:

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by drbass » 24 Feb 2018, 19:31

packrat wrote:
24 Feb 2018, 18:19
All this mystery is just going to see more people asking you to take pictures.
I have pics, Bruce - I take pics along the way for my records - this time I just want to wait until it's fully finished. Unless you'd be happy with a teaser black-and white version (I've done that before ;) ).

Regards,
Michael
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
- Genzler Magellan 800, 2 Genzler BA12-3

packrat
Posts: 631
Joined: 27 Oct 2017, 02:17
Location: Sydney

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by packrat » 24 Feb 2018, 22:05

Is this the final blue thing, or something new and mysterious? MOre teasers of the latter.

User avatar
drbass
Posts: 3068
Joined: 04 Apr 2013, 05:31
Location: Doreen, Victoria
Contact:

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by drbass » 25 Feb 2018, 13:42

packrat wrote:
24 Feb 2018, 22:05
Is this the final blue thing, or something new and mysterious? MOre teasers of the latter.
No, nothing new, just the Manta YOLO edition ;) .

Regards,
Michael
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
- Genzler Magellan 800, 2 Genzler BA12-3

User avatar
drbass
Posts: 3068
Joined: 04 Apr 2013, 05:31
Location: Doreen, Victoria
Contact:

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by drbass » 25 Feb 2018, 18:34

Gee, looking at all those builds happening at the moment I might have to throw in the towel ... .

Before I do here's a little glue experiment. Got myself some Gorilla glue, a polyurethane glue. It's a single component glue (just like Titebond) that requires some moisture to cure and set properly.



The advantage is that the glue expands about 3-fold while it cures (think polyurethane foam that's used to fill hard-to-reach cavities) which means small gaps are OK, and any voids in the timber will be filled (provided the clamping is done with the appropriate pressure.

So here's the result. These are just two offcuts that were not particularly flat (in fact, they wobbled a little). Small amount of glue applied (looks and behaves like honey, actually) and single clamp used to squeeze it together. Left overnight.



You can hopefully see the foam buildup on the outside.

So how strong is it? I pushed down really hard and couldn't move it - at all. Instead I actually cracked a Titebond glue line (which surprises me since that's supposed to be more stable than the wood). Anyway, it was a fairly narrow/small surface area so not concerned about my glue-ups done so far.

So will I use it in the future? Sure looks interesting, and seems to bond very strongly. Doesn't introduce moisture at all, in fact it removes some. But it's pretty viscous, and while the expansion can be a positive thing it also makes it somewhat unsuitable for fretboards if the truss rod is not completely "isolated" (since it would expand into the space and glue the truss rod in - not exactly what you want).

Next will be the extended epoxy experiment. I'd love to have a low viscosity glue that can also be used to stabilise brittle timbers like spalted maple. The araldite sort of works but it doesn't penetrate particularly well. I'll see if I can source some West System resin and hardener in the next couple of weeks and give that a shot.

Stay tuned.

Regards,
Michael
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
- Genzler Magellan 800, 2 Genzler BA12-3

User avatar
BigDaddy
Posts: 331
Joined: 19 May 2014, 08:58
Location: Adelaide, SA

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by BigDaddy » 25 Feb 2018, 19:24

Michael - I recall using a veneer glue in the past that was very similar to the gorilla glue but was quite runny (think epoxy, thin honey like). It was excellent stuff and it would actually bleed through the veneers under clamping pressure but scraped off easily. I'll see if I have any about to advise of the brand etc.
Basses: Sandberg, Fender, SUB & Squier
Amps & Cabs: Ashdown, Ampeg, Tecamp & Aguilar

User avatar
Classic5
Posts: 3785
Joined: 15 Oct 2009, 19:33
Location: Melbourne

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by Classic5 » 25 Feb 2018, 19:27

Always interesting reading the results of your experimentation Michael.
IB-Classic#001, Xotic XJ-1T 5,Yamaha BB1024X
Glockenklang Blue Soul, Glockenklang Double, TecAmp Puma 112 Combo
"Money will buy a fine dog but only kindness will make him wag his tail"

User avatar
drbass
Posts: 3068
Joined: 04 Apr 2013, 05:31
Location: Doreen, Victoria
Contact:

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by drbass » 25 Feb 2018, 20:19

BigDaddy wrote:
25 Feb 2018, 19:24
Michael - I recall using a veneer glue in the past that was very similar to the gorilla glue but was quite runny (think epoxy, thin honey like). It was excellent stuff and it would actually bleed through the veneers under clamping pressure but scraped off easily. I'll see if I have any about to advise of the brand etc.
:thumbup:
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
- Genzler Magellan 800, 2 Genzler BA12-3

User avatar
BigDaddy
Posts: 331
Joined: 19 May 2014, 08:58
Location: Adelaide, SA

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by BigDaddy » 26 Feb 2018, 21:57

The glue had used with veneers was titebond polyurethane. The bottle was all foamed up and solid!
Basses: Sandberg, Fender, SUB & Squier
Amps & Cabs: Ashdown, Ampeg, Tecamp & Aguilar

User avatar
drbass
Posts: 3068
Joined: 04 Apr 2013, 05:31
Location: Doreen, Victoria
Contact:

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by drbass » 27 Feb 2018, 07:09

BigDaddy wrote:
26 Feb 2018, 21:57
The glue had used with veneers was titebond polyurethane. The bottle was all foamed up and solid!
So pretty much the same stuff.

PU is somewhat interesting since it is not an exactly defined class of molecules. The polymerisation reaction can occur with a range of molecules.
Having said that according to the MSDS both Gorilla and Titebond have the same active ingredients but the Gorilla version is 2 - 3 times more concentrated (that's probably why it is rather viscous, and the Titebond "runny").

You obviously stored yours for a fairly long time, and somehow water (vapour) was able to get in - and that starts the polymerisation. Recommendation for timbers is to lightly dampen one of the surfaces (with hardwood both) before glueing it up. The reaction generates some carbon dioxide which gives you the "foam".

BTW, "Gorilla Glue" also refers to a cannabis strain :) . Will invoke a very different reaction.

Regards,
Michael
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
- Genzler Magellan 800, 2 Genzler BA12-3

User avatar
BigDaddy
Posts: 331
Joined: 19 May 2014, 08:58
Location: Adelaide, SA

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by BigDaddy » 27 Feb 2018, 07:35

Yep. I hadn't used it for about 5yrs and there was perhaps a 1/3 left. I never dampened surfaces with it but always put baking paper between the job and the clamping cauls to avoid squeeze out accidentally sticking a caul to the job. This is important with these expanding glues!
Basses: Sandberg, Fender, SUB & Squier
Amps & Cabs: Ashdown, Ampeg, Tecamp & Aguilar

User avatar
drbass
Posts: 3068
Joined: 04 Apr 2013, 05:31
Location: Doreen, Victoria
Contact:

Re: Future Builds - Maybe Random

Post by drbass » 02 Mar 2018, 14:50

Frets dressed - so glad that's over, one of my least favourite activities. Thing is: if you don't do it properly the whole instrument will be sh.t.

Plan is to have everything assembled and ready to play for next week's gigs (Friday night at Musicland, Saturday night in Heathcote at Idavue Estate - "Reds and Blues", how fitting. Pics when it's all together.

Regards,
Michael
- Merlin “Kermit” 6 multi, Merlin Gaia 6 fretless, Merlin Rockmachine 5, Merlin NT5, Manta 5, Manta 5 YOLO, ("Red Baron" 5), Q 5, (Sandberg Classic S2-5), (Thumb-4)
- Genzler Magellan 800, 2 Genzler BA12-3

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests