Rosewood bans..

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ozrider
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by ozrider » 25 Jun 2017, 01:08

ozrider wrote:
Petebass wrote:Warmoth have released a statement saying they are CITES compliant now, so it's possible others have also jumped through the hoops. Can't hurt to ask.

I have just asked a supplier in the UK about CITES compliance... fingers crossed. :popcorn:
Ok they have said they are CITES compliant but want me to place an order before they will answer my question about shipping to Australia. I guess they will just tell me they don't ship that particular bass after I do just that. They are only going to ship rosewood in the EU I imagine.

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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by glen_with_1_n » 30 Jun 2017, 14:44

Ive read through this entire thread and aspects of it are still confusing.

Im in Japan at the moment, family emergency for my fiancé. We left suddenly, and unexpectedly, and potentially could be here for a while due to the nature of the experience.

Im currently thinking of buying a bass, something to keep my chops up and practise with in the downtime. Last year when we came I almost bought a really cheap, used Tokai Hard Puncher. It had a rosewood neck. I was hoping to buy something similar this time, and take it home when we leave, but I'm not sure what i'd have to do, if I have to do anything to get it home.

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ozrider
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by ozrider » 30 Jun 2017, 14:55

glen_with_1_n wrote:Ive read through this entire thread and aspects of it are still confusing.

Im in Japan at the moment, family emergency for my fiancé. We left suddenly, and unexpectedly, and potentially could be here for a while due to the nature of the experience.

Im currently thinking of buying a bass, something to keep my chops up and practise with in the downtime. Last year when we came I almost bought a really cheap, used Tokai Hard Puncher. It had a rosewood neck. I was hoping to buy something similar this time, and take it home when we leave, but I'm not sure what i'd have to do, if I have to do anything to get it home.
I've been doing a bit of research too. Some sites are now suggesting they can do CITES pre-certification for per-2017 convention basses. I think on the ground here in Australia they aren't doing much about 2nd hand guitars/basses from what I understand.

glen_with_1_n
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by glen_with_1_n » 01 Jul 2017, 09:10

Yeah I've read a bit on some websites, and on talk bass which as we all know varies in its opinions and reliability.

I had sort of understood that it to be strict on new basses, but the information on used basses seems a little unclear.

Does anyone have any more reliable resources?

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Petebass
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by Petebass » 01 Jul 2017, 16:49

"To keep up with the new CITES regulations on rosewood, Sandberg Guitars has turned to a new fingerboard option: steamed oak".

http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2017/06/23 ... gerboards/
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by Petebass » 01 Jul 2017, 16:52

OK is it just me or does every single alternative to rosewood have a blurb that " it has the warmth of rosewood yet gives (sic) response similar to maple and a sharper attack like ebony".
* 2 Stingray 5's (one heavily modded), Ibanez SR805, Ashbory, + more...
* Carvin B1500, Epifani PS1000, Ashdown Superfly amps.
* Lots of DIY neo/lightweight cabs including one made from composites http://www.ozbassforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2546

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ozrider
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by ozrider » 01 Jul 2017, 17:16

Petebass wrote:OK is it just me or does every single alternative to rosewood have a blurb that " it has the warmth of rosewood yet gives (sic) response similar to maple and a sharper attack like ebony".
It does it all...

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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by glen_with_1_n » 11 Jul 2017, 12:12

So it looks like I've inherited a guitar while in Japan. Its a Chinese Epiphone Wilshire from 2011, with a rosewood neck, worth about $300-400.

Im planning on getting a hardcase and bringing it back to Aus when I fly home.

Can anyone see any issues with it having a rosewood neck? It will technically be a personal instrument, and will be under the 10kg restriction.

Id hate to have it confiscated, especially due to the circumstances around who I am inheriting it from.

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Soong
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by Soong » 11 Jul 2017, 12:24

Has anyone attempted to buy a bass from ebay/talkbass/reverb and gotten the seller to pay for and attach out a CITES form?
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veebass
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by veebass » 14 Sep 2017, 07:53

OK, I am not sure whether this info has been posted elsewhere but I thought it may be useful.

Australian Customs advisory notice about rosewood importation/ exportation published by Australian Music Association.

http://www.australianmusic.asn.au/indus ... gulations/
INDUSTRY ADVISORY ON NEW ROSEWOOD TRADE REGULATIONS
Industry Advisory on New Rosewood Trade Regulations

A number of species of timber commonly referred to as rosewoods have recently been included on Appendix II of the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES).

The Appendix II listing will take effect on 2 January 2017, and any imports or exports of items containing rosewood will generally require CITES documentation from this date. The listing is intended to regulate international trade to ensure that ongoing trade can continue, but only in a sustainable manner. Countries harvesting and exporting rosewood will now be required to demonstrate that international trade is sustainable.

Australia’s federal Department of the Environment and Energy implements CITES requirements under national environment law (the Environment Protection and Biodiversity Conservation Act 1999). The Department has provided the following details on CITES requirements for rosewoods once the listing comes into effect on 2 January 2017.

Synopsis of the regulatory requirements resulting from the listing of Dalbergia spp. (rosewood) on Appendix II of CITES, which includes Indian rosewood (Dalbergia latifolia, Dalbergia sisso).

The listing applies to both raw timber and finished products, with the exception of:

a) Leaves, flowers, pollen, fruits, and seeds,
b) Non-commercial exports of a maximum total weight of 10 kg per shipment,
c) Parts and derivatives of Dalbergia cochinchinensis, which are covered by Annotation # 4, and
d) Parts and derivatives of Dalbergia spp. originating and exported from Mexico, which are covered by Annotation # 6.
As our industry will primarily be importing/exporting timber and finished products for commercial purposes, the above exemptions will not apply, and CITES documentation will be required.

Exports:

If you are exporting from existing stocks of rosewood, provided they were harvested before the listing date (2 January 2017), you will be required to obtain a CITES pre-Convention certificate from the Australian CITES Management Authority (the Department of the Environment and Energy). Pre-Convention certificates certify that the item was obtained before the CITES listing took effect. They are issued free of charge, and are valid for a period of 6 months. The Department suggests members also contact the CITES Management Authority of the importing country to find out if there are any import requirements for pre-Convention items – you can find the contact details here: https://cites.org/eng/cms/index.php/component/cp .
Evidentiary requirements for a pre-Convention certificate:

To obtain an Australian CITES pre-Convention certificate you will need to demonstrate the specimen is not an Australian native species, that the specimen was obtained legally, and that it is a pre-Convention specimen.

You will have to demonstrate this with records that pre-date 2 January 2017.

Examples of how to demonstrate the origin and legal source of the specimen:

– Receipt of purchase stating the country of origin

– A record of the shipment or transit of the item into Australia

– A Statutory Declaration and supporting information detailing how the item was acquired

Examples of how to demonstrate a specimen is a pre-Convention specimen:

– An independent age assessment of the item demonstrating it was obtained prior to 2 January 2017.

– A Statutory Declaration with relevant supporting information demonstrating the specimen was obtained prior to 2 January 2017.

For re-export of specimens harvested after the listing date (2 January 2017):

If you are re-exporting rosewood harvested after the listing date (2 January 2017), you will be required to obtain an Australian CITES re-export permit from the Australian CITES Management Authority (the Department of the Environment and Energy). These are valid for a period of 6 months, and are issued at a charge of $65 for a single use permit, or $163 for a multiple use permit – a single use allows one shipment per permit, whereas a multiple use allows multiple shipments under the one permit, provided they occur within the 6 month validity period and do not exceed the total number of specimens outlined on the multiple use permit. It is recommended that you also contact the CITES Management Authority of the importing country to find out what import requirements they may have.
Evidentiary requirements for a re-export permit:

To obtain an Australian CITES re-export permit, you need to demonstrate the specimen was legally (re) exported from the last country of export and imported into Australia. Documentation required includes:

– The CITES (re) export permit the country of last (re) export

– The Australian CITES import permit

Please note the acquittal paperwork for the import of the specimen must be complete and returned to the Department before a re-export permit can be granted.

For imports:

If you are importing from existing stocks of rosewood harvested before the listing date of 2 January 2017, you will require a CITES pre-Convention certificate from the exporting country. This certificate will need to travel with the shipment. You do not need any documentation from Australia to import pre-Convention items. The Department advises that you send a copy of the overseas pre-Convention certificate to them via email so they can confirm the pre-Convention certificate meets Australia’s requirements (as each CITES Party issues pre-Convention certificates differently).
If you are importing rosewood harvested after the listing date (2 January 2017), you will require a CITES (re) export permit from the exporting country and an Australian CITES import permit. These are valid for 6 months and can be issued for a single use import or for multiple imports. Both permits must be issued prior to the shipment occurring, and be valid until the shipment has taken place.
Contact the Wildlife Trade Permits team on (02) 6274 1900 (option 3) or at wildlifetrade@environment.gov.au for more information on CITES permits.



FAQ

Which species of rosewood will be listed under CITES on 2 January 2017?

All species of the Dalbergia genus except Dalbergia nigra (Brazilian rosewood), which is already listed on Appendix I of CITES
Pterocarpus erinaceus
Guibourtia demeusei, Guibourtia pellegriniana, Guibourtia tessmannii (collectively referred to as African rosewood, Akume or Bubinga)
What does this mean?

From 2 January 2017, international imports and exports of items or products containing any of these newly listed rosewood species must be accompanied by relevant CITES documentation.

Species listed on Appendix II of CITES may be traded internationally, provided the trade has been determined to be non-detrimental to the survival of the species in the wild. Once deemed sustainable, trade is generally regulated through permits that authorise the import or export of the item containing the CITES listed species.

Imports and exports of most items containing rosewood will require CITES documentation, including items / products obtained before 2 January 2017.

CITES documentation is generally not required for imports and exports of personal items of up to 10 kg per shipment containing either Dalbergia or any of the three listed Guibourtia species.

How much does a CITES permit cost?

A single use CITES permit (for one single export or import) costs $65.

A CITES multiple consignment authority (which allows multiple exports or imports within a six month period) costs $163.

A pre-Convention CITES certificate, which is required to certify that the item was obtained before the listing came into effect, is free.

How long does it take to issue a CITES permit?

Under Australian law, a CITES permit application must be assessed within 40 business days of all relevant information being received from the applicant. To minimise disruption to businesses during the transitional period, the Department will try to process any permit applications for rosewood as quickly as possible, within available resources.

Why has the listing occurred?

The Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES) is an international agreement that aims to ensure that international trade in wild plants and animals does not threaten species’ survival in the wild. Rosewood has been listed on Appendix II to CITES because international trade in these timbers needs to be controlled to avoid impacts on their survival in the wild.

What is the position where a shipment is currently on the water containing pre-CITES wood or products, and will not berth before January 2, 2016?

Where possible the department recommends you avoid /delay shipments that may fall into the timeframe of being shipped prior to listing and arriving after listing, though we understand that will not always be possible. If Australian Border Force seizes your shipment, you may apply to the Department for the return of your specimens. The Department will take a pragmatic approach and consider all available information regarding the timing of the shipment and supporting documentation when assessing your application for release.

How can I find out more?

More information on how to obtain a CITES permit is available from the Department of the Environment and Energy at http://www.environment.gov.au/biodivers ... life-trade or:

The Director

Wildlife Trade Regulation

Department of the Environment and Energy

GPO Box 787

Canberra ACT 2601

Telephone: (02) 6274 1900

Facsimile: (02) 6274 1921

Email: wildlifetrade@environment.gov.au

This entry was posted in News on November 24, 2016 by Rob Walker.
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PilbaraBass
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by PilbaraBass » 14 Sep 2017, 12:23

Petebass wrote:
01 Jul 2017, 16:49
"To keep up with the new CITES regulations on rosewood, Sandberg Guitars has turned to a new fingerboard option: steamed oak".

http://www.notreble.com/buzz/2017/06/23 ... gerboards/
Interesting... Oak is indeed a plentiful wood in Europe and North America... It's quite hard and quite heavy (good thing it's only a fingerboard/fretboard)... It looks pretty cool... would love to try one and see how one feels...
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MentalPatient
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by MentalPatient » 05 Feb 2018, 22:34

lostdoggy wrote:
10 Jan 2017, 19:09
What's the status of ebony these days?
I would like to know this as well. Looking at the list I think it's ok unless something has changed, such a mine field.
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JimP
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by JimP » 09 Jun 2018, 20:07

Hi guys, reviving this thread to see if anyone can clarify the situation re: importing a second hand guitar with a rosewood fretboard. I've read few different threads but I'm still a bit confused. Asking specifically re: importing a Gibson Les Paul from a Japanese seller into Australia. Thanks in advance :thumbup:
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packrat
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by packrat » 09 Jun 2018, 22:22

It’s not at all uniformly enforced.

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JimP
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Re: Rosewood bans..

Post by JimP » 10 Jun 2018, 07:39

packrat wrote:
09 Jun 2018, 22:22
It’s not at all uniformly enforced.
The stand out sentence in the Customs regulations posted by veebass is "CITES documentation is generally not required for imports and exports of personal items of up to 10 kg per shipment containing either Dalbergia or any of the three listed Guibourtia species."

Is this people's experience in the real world? Does it mean I can just import a single guitar and not worry about certificates, confiscation etc?
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